Thanks to all who have sent their prayers while my brother was in the
hospital. I'm not sure how some of you found out. For those who didn't
know, he somehow caught a strain of viral meningitis (the good kind) and was
in the hospital until today. Luckily it wasn't bacterial meningitis (the
bad kind). He is doing tons better compared to how he was initially doing
and at this point, he just needs rest and he'll be fine.
Needless to say, I never had the opportunity to mail or even make the
holiday CD this year. Unfortunately, this e-mail is going to have to serve
as my holiday card for 2003 and as unpersonal as it may seem, I truly hope
you all have a happy holiday season and wish you the best for 2004.
Cheers,
-Curtis
12.23.2003
Thank you.
12.11.2003
undercover bi men
I realized I never sent out the most eloquent responses that I received to my friend's e-mail about the undercover bi-men.....
here you go.. since it has been so long, here is the original e-mail at the top, and the responses below
peace,
-c
-----------------------
original e-mail
-----------------------
Okay, so my alarm goes off at 6:30 this morning to Hot 105.1 as it ususally does. I love Ed and Dre in the morning (with Monie Luv in da middle) cause they are hilarious and very good at having interesting people come on the show. Well, this morning's topic was "How to Tell If Your Man Is Gay or Bisexual" and the author of the book so titled was Shaharazad Ali (most of you might remember her infamous guide on "What Black Women Should Do To Get A Man" or something like that). Anyway, as most of you know I am paranoid about dating black men in NYC because I feel that many, if not most, of them are gay or bisexual. A few of you have forwarded e-mails to me that have discussed this same topic. Apparently, there is a subculture of black men who are dating or married and are also leading double lives. Many of them frequent their local gyms or even bathhouses to engage in homosexual activity. Now don't get me wrong, I am a fan of gay men (I have a very close friend who is gay and his sexuality doesn't mean a thing to me), however, we're not dating and we are not going to date. He wouldn't date me, but some of his bisexual friends would. Therefore, what I am trying to do is really find out if there are signs or any indicia that I, and my single, heterosexual female friends, can look to that will alert us to a guy playing for both teams.
I have one friend whose name I won't mention ("Hey Tanisha!") that thinks that this whole idea of black men being gay on the DL is either all in my head or that I am taking it too far. But I feel it's better to be safe than sorry. Yes, I have found black men who aren't gay and we have had good relationships. But I feel like I have been fortunate and that lately that is not the norm.
Nevertheless, the question remains as to what we, as women, should do to not get ourselves into this situation. Yes, I want to date more than just this one safe guy that I graduated from HU with. Yes, I feel that there are many, many black men who are not engaging in this type of behavior. The caveat is that I cannot tell them from those who are. For all of the men on this e-mail list (and even women if you have some tips), please let us know what we should look for when dating a guy so that we don't find ourselves in a bad situation. Again, I have nothing against anyone being gay (do your thang!), I just don't want to date you if that is what you are into.
----------------------------
responses
------------------------
Hey don't shoot the messenger. I honestly don't think there's a device or way to really know if your man's living a double life. There are men who marry/have kids/live this heterosexual life for years on end, later to reveal they're gay or bisexual and NOW they want to be open and honest about it. And no one had a clue. What can you do? Like any relationship, you hope the person you're involved with would have the decency to be upfront with you, but it's not always the case. You can go around checking out what they're doing, but eventually you have to take the person's word for it. If you don't trust the person, then you shouldn't be with them.
----------------------------
okay, so here is my reply. i thought for awhile that i wouldn't reply to this e-mail because it was way too close minded and conspiracy thoerist-like. my experience with discussing issues with these people is that they have no capacity to objectively reason a counterpoint, and they are always talking louder than necessary (as if that would convince me any more of their point.) in any case i must respond.
this woman states that she is afraid of finding a new man for fear that they may be gay, yet she states that she has been with a man who is "safe" for years. my question is "why the hell is she so worried about this????!!!!"
this woman has NEVER had a run in with a bisexual that she knows of, but this woman is scared into dating this one guy because of what she has read and heard about.
i once heard a story about a woman that has teeth coming out of her clit, but i still try to get new ass. and even if i had the unfortunate unpleasure of running intyo this woman with this genital dental nightmare, i doubthat would turn me away from woman.
i believe the true story lies behing the words she wrote. i think she is a woman that likes this dude she's been with. this guy screwed her over more than just a few times and she is rationalizing a reason to stay with this asshole. all she needs to do is slap herself out of this phobia, get fucked well by the next guy and hopefully she will be treated well, then her problem will have resolved itself.
as for bisexual men and bathhouses. i say let'em do their thing. if they don't tell their significant other well, hey, that's the risk you take when giving your heart to someone. some guys lie about their job, some lie about children they have, some lie about getting fucked in the ass...........shit happens.
by the way i refuse to beleive it is as much a problem as she is trying to portray. and if it is i think i should be more worried then she is.
-----------------------
Hmmm interesting topic..
I guess for me, the only thing I can suggest is that you ask. And ask early
enough so that the brother isn't offended or put off by your question. The
key to asking is to remember to keep it light as if it's just part of your
"getting to know you" repertoire. You know kind of like when you ask him
about what his fantasies are etc. pop that question..."Have you ever thought
about being with another man?" and then don't seem shocked when you hear the
answer.... 'cause chances are if the brother thinks you are going to be
appalled and walk out, he is not going to respond truthfully.
I too have a close friend who is gay, and I used to share your same anxiety.
I'd always ask him if he saw this brother or that brother out.... LOL! After
a while I just decided that there really wasn't any point in doing that. To
me, you just gotta look out for the signs that the man is not being honest.
Pay attention to anything you think is strange. No offense to the brothers
but, men are not that clever when it comes to lying and cheating. Sooner or
later he'll slip up. Let's just hope it's while you still have that nickel
btwn your knees. LOL!
--------------------------
Bottom line. A Liar is A Liar and there
is no need for a separate category for gay or straight. If your man is
interested in anyone else man or women or anyone else besides you, he needs
to be truthful with saying he's not interested. I think as whole societies
own fears and rejection of the gay lifestyle is what makes it hard for
brothas to come out the closet in the first place. Why are people always
seeking to "out" them or find out there sexual status continues to
perpetrate the feelings of rejection that keep these brothas on the DL. If
we put more focus on brothas (gay or str8) being honest..then it wouldn't
matter if he left you for a man or women, he just left you!
I think we are looking for a list of signs or symbols (If your man drinks
his coffee with 2 hands he's gay) type of stuff and that again just shows
how we love to take outside appearances, actions, and stereotypes to judge
someone and that is not right. I understand women fear being lied to but
honestly gay and str8 men lie..they just lie about different things. In
other words don't look to see if you man is gay..look for a liar they are
easier to figure out. If you are concerned about someone being gay, be
concerned that they are living a closeted life that leaves them lonely,
searching, in denial and confused and help that brotha accept himself. As
for the liar, get rid of him!
-----------------------------
If he's black wears Armani|Exchange....he might be gay
If his closet is 50% Banana Republic....he might be gay
If the other half of his closet is Kenneth Cole....he might be gay
If he is over 30 and hasn't had a girlfriend in 3 yrs...he might be gay
If he is still a fan of Whitney Houston...he might be gay
If he is a fan of Madonna....he might be gay
If he is a fan of Cher.....he definitely is gay!
If he dressed up at a Halloween party in anything close fitting...he might be gay
If he notices your hair, purse, bag or shoes when they are new...he might be gay
If he doesn't act like he is trying to get into your pants...even on the first date...he might be gay because men are only after one thing!
If he wants to get to know you better before going to the next step...he might be gay.
If he works out at a pretty boy gym... 5 times a week....he might be gay
If he uses the word "fabulous"...he definitely is gay
The problem here is that the black community is so culturally behind, that being gay is still such a disgrace that the majority of black gay men have to keep it on the DL. This is an ever increasing problem especially in these times of AIDS. You best line of defense is to use your out and proud gay friends who might be able to tell you if they have seen him out before, or have then use their gaydar on your prospective man.
And please, if he is stupid enough to say that he has experimented with guys before....RUN LIKE HELL!
I should know, I am a proud black gay man.
-----------------------------
Shit, I'm so obsessed with the cheating, I never even bothered to open up the
possibility that it might be with a man, for crying out loud! (My boyfriend does
have unusually "naturally" manicured nails...and he did get a strange call from
a man the other night at 3 in the morning...fuck!)
------------------------
I have nothing against homosexuals/lesbians; I have befriended both. I do have a problem dating a male that is bisexual though. Although it hasn't been my first concern of the day, this email has made me wander. Last night as I cruised around Dream Night Club checking out prospects I couldn't help but to wander who was my competition. The chick in the mini, show all skirt could be competition but she could also be trying to mack me. I could have allot more in common than I think with the guy standing next to me smelling and looking good. You just don’t know and cannot tell in this day and age.
Bobby and Mantrell, I don't think that there is more bi woman, I think its more acceptable; its supposed to be every hetero male's fantasy. Bisexual black men are not as acceptable therefore there is shame or a need to keep it hidden. Last night in Dream there were 3 girls dancing and touching all over each other, can you imagine if it were 3 black men? There would have been a riot up in there, hetero men would be defending their masculinity and the "in the closet" homosexuals/bisexuals would have to respond the same to keep their secret a secret. I guess the big issue is how each individual truly sees a gay or lesbian, some don't mind it, some are detested by it and some enjoy it.
My belief is information there is crucial info that each partner should tell the other before things get too serious so a decision can be made. If you can tolerate that your new love has been with the same sex, then you stay. If you cannot tolerate the news then you leave before things take a real deep turn. I met a guy at Black Lilly in downtown Manhattan, we talked often over the phone, went on a date, he informed me that he used to have a crack addiction (VERY CRUCIAL INFO). At that point before feelings were involved I had the opportunity to make a decision that was best for me. I knew we could converse but there was no future. A few months later I called his place of employment and his boss asked me did I see him and if I did to tell him he was looking for him. I then knew I made the right decision.
Bottom line is keep it honest and give the other person as much info as they need to make a decision that is best for them to achieve their goal. The worse thing to steal from a person is time. This goes for heterosexuals, bisexuals and gays. If you don't see a future with that person let them know. They could pass Mr. and Ms. right every day, all day and they don't see them because they are under the impression they are in a loving relationship when all they are is a hobby, something to do or someone to mooch off of.
--------------------
Your friend's email gives the impression of a New York where the majority of black men are bisexual. Perhaps if these concerns stem from experiences you have already had, we should talk about how some of the characteristics that black women find attractive are prevalent or at least sterotyped to be prevalent in the homo/bisexual community. Although these characteristics (very well dressed, very empathetic to female needs, etc) should in no way enable someone to determine, with 100% certainty, someone else's individual sexual preferences, I would be concerned about dating someone who was so much my best friend, that I didn't need my female friends any longer. Also, there seems to be far more bisexual women than there are bisexual men. Women hate when there is gender based discrimination against them (imagine the baby mama/ baby daddy situation in terms of dating). And cheating is cheating, whether it be with a man or a woman, so if you found someone that you really liked, perhaps it shouldn't matter what kind of relationships they have had in their past as long once you get to the point where you are considering making a commitment you have a good understanding of what the expectations are.
Of course we are married and hopefull won't have to worry about dating ever again!
------------------------------
here you go.. since it has been so long, here is the original e-mail at the top, and the responses below
peace,
-c
-----------------------
original e-mail
-----------------------
Okay, so my alarm goes off at 6:30 this morning to Hot 105.1 as it ususally does. I love Ed and Dre in the morning (with Monie Luv in da middle) cause they are hilarious and very good at having interesting people come on the show. Well, this morning's topic was "How to Tell If Your Man Is Gay or Bisexual" and the author of the book so titled was Shaharazad Ali (most of you might remember her infamous guide on "What Black Women Should Do To Get A Man" or something like that). Anyway, as most of you know I am paranoid about dating black men in NYC because I feel that many, if not most, of them are gay or bisexual. A few of you have forwarded e-mails to me that have discussed this same topic. Apparently, there is a subculture of black men who are dating or married and are also leading double lives. Many of them frequent their local gyms or even bathhouses to engage in homosexual activity. Now don't get me wrong, I am a fan of gay men (I have a very close friend who is gay and his sexuality doesn't mean a thing to me), however, we're not dating and we are not going to date. He wouldn't date me, but some of his bisexual friends would. Therefore, what I am trying to do is really find out if there are signs or any indicia that I, and my single, heterosexual female friends, can look to that will alert us to a guy playing for both teams.
I have one friend whose name I won't mention ("Hey Tanisha!") that thinks that this whole idea of black men being gay on the DL is either all in my head or that I am taking it too far. But I feel it's better to be safe than sorry. Yes, I have found black men who aren't gay and we have had good relationships. But I feel like I have been fortunate and that lately that is not the norm.
Nevertheless, the question remains as to what we, as women, should do to not get ourselves into this situation. Yes, I want to date more than just this one safe guy that I graduated from HU with. Yes, I feel that there are many, many black men who are not engaging in this type of behavior. The caveat is that I cannot tell them from those who are. For all of the men on this e-mail list (and even women if you have some tips), please let us know what we should look for when dating a guy so that we don't find ourselves in a bad situation. Again, I have nothing against anyone being gay (do your thang!), I just don't want to date you if that is what you are into.
----------------------------
responses
------------------------
Hey don't shoot the messenger. I honestly don't think there's a device or way to really know if your man's living a double life. There are men who marry/have kids/live this heterosexual life for years on end, later to reveal they're gay or bisexual and NOW they want to be open and honest about it. And no one had a clue. What can you do? Like any relationship, you hope the person you're involved with would have the decency to be upfront with you, but it's not always the case. You can go around checking out what they're doing, but eventually you have to take the person's word for it. If you don't trust the person, then you shouldn't be with them.
----------------------------
okay, so here is my reply. i thought for awhile that i wouldn't reply to this e-mail because it was way too close minded and conspiracy thoerist-like. my experience with discussing issues with these people is that they have no capacity to objectively reason a counterpoint, and they are always talking louder than necessary (as if that would convince me any more of their point.) in any case i must respond.
this woman states that she is afraid of finding a new man for fear that they may be gay, yet she states that she has been with a man who is "safe" for years. my question is "why the hell is she so worried about this????!!!!"
this woman has NEVER had a run in with a bisexual that she knows of, but this woman is scared into dating this one guy because of what she has read and heard about.
i once heard a story about a woman that has teeth coming out of her clit, but i still try to get new ass. and even if i had the unfortunate unpleasure of running intyo this woman with this genital dental nightmare, i doubthat would turn me away from woman.
i believe the true story lies behing the words she wrote. i think she is a woman that likes this dude she's been with. this guy screwed her over more than just a few times and she is rationalizing a reason to stay with this asshole. all she needs to do is slap herself out of this phobia, get fucked well by the next guy and hopefully she will be treated well, then her problem will have resolved itself.
as for bisexual men and bathhouses. i say let'em do their thing. if they don't tell their significant other well, hey, that's the risk you take when giving your heart to someone. some guys lie about their job, some lie about children they have, some lie about getting fucked in the ass...........shit happens.
by the way i refuse to beleive it is as much a problem as she is trying to portray. and if it is i think i should be more worried then she is.
-----------------------
Hmmm interesting topic..
I guess for me, the only thing I can suggest is that you ask. And ask early
enough so that the brother isn't offended or put off by your question. The
key to asking is to remember to keep it light as if it's just part of your
"getting to know you" repertoire. You know kind of like when you ask him
about what his fantasies are etc. pop that question..."Have you ever thought
about being with another man?" and then don't seem shocked when you hear the
answer.... 'cause chances are if the brother thinks you are going to be
appalled and walk out, he is not going to respond truthfully.
I too have a close friend who is gay, and I used to share your same anxiety.
I'd always ask him if he saw this brother or that brother out.... LOL! After
a while I just decided that there really wasn't any point in doing that. To
me, you just gotta look out for the signs that the man is not being honest.
Pay attention to anything you think is strange. No offense to the brothers
but, men are not that clever when it comes to lying and cheating. Sooner or
later he'll slip up. Let's just hope it's while you still have that nickel
btwn your knees. LOL!
--------------------------
Bottom line. A Liar is A Liar and there
is no need for a separate category for gay or straight. If your man is
interested in anyone else man or women or anyone else besides you, he needs
to be truthful with saying he's not interested. I think as whole societies
own fears and rejection of the gay lifestyle is what makes it hard for
brothas to come out the closet in the first place. Why are people always
seeking to "out" them or find out there sexual status continues to
perpetrate the feelings of rejection that keep these brothas on the DL. If
we put more focus on brothas (gay or str8) being honest..then it wouldn't
matter if he left you for a man or women, he just left you!
I think we are looking for a list of signs or symbols (If your man drinks
his coffee with 2 hands he's gay) type of stuff and that again just shows
how we love to take outside appearances, actions, and stereotypes to judge
someone and that is not right. I understand women fear being lied to but
honestly gay and str8 men lie..they just lie about different things. In
other words don't look to see if you man is gay..look for a liar they are
easier to figure out. If you are concerned about someone being gay, be
concerned that they are living a closeted life that leaves them lonely,
searching, in denial and confused and help that brotha accept himself. As
for the liar, get rid of him!
-----------------------------
If he's black wears Armani|Exchange....he might be gay
If his closet is 50% Banana Republic....he might be gay
If the other half of his closet is Kenneth Cole....he might be gay
If he is over 30 and hasn't had a girlfriend in 3 yrs...he might be gay
If he is still a fan of Whitney Houston...he might be gay
If he is a fan of Madonna....he might be gay
If he is a fan of Cher.....he definitely is gay!
If he dressed up at a Halloween party in anything close fitting...he might be gay
If he notices your hair, purse, bag or shoes when they are new...he might be gay
If he doesn't act like he is trying to get into your pants...even on the first date...he might be gay because men are only after one thing!
If he wants to get to know you better before going to the next step...he might be gay.
If he works out at a pretty boy gym... 5 times a week....he might be gay
If he uses the word "fabulous"...he definitely is gay
The problem here is that the black community is so culturally behind, that being gay is still such a disgrace that the majority of black gay men have to keep it on the DL. This is an ever increasing problem especially in these times of AIDS. You best line of defense is to use your out and proud gay friends who might be able to tell you if they have seen him out before, or have then use their gaydar on your prospective man.
And please, if he is stupid enough to say that he has experimented with guys before....RUN LIKE HELL!
I should know, I am a proud black gay man.
-----------------------------
Shit, I'm so obsessed with the cheating, I never even bothered to open up the
possibility that it might be with a man, for crying out loud! (My boyfriend does
have unusually "naturally" manicured nails...and he did get a strange call from
a man the other night at 3 in the morning...fuck!)
------------------------
I have nothing against homosexuals/lesbians; I have befriended both. I do have a problem dating a male that is bisexual though. Although it hasn't been my first concern of the day, this email has made me wander. Last night as I cruised around Dream Night Club checking out prospects I couldn't help but to wander who was my competition. The chick in the mini, show all skirt could be competition but she could also be trying to mack me. I could have allot more in common than I think with the guy standing next to me smelling and looking good. You just don’t know and cannot tell in this day and age.
Bobby and Mantrell, I don't think that there is more bi woman, I think its more acceptable; its supposed to be every hetero male's fantasy. Bisexual black men are not as acceptable therefore there is shame or a need to keep it hidden. Last night in Dream there were 3 girls dancing and touching all over each other, can you imagine if it were 3 black men? There would have been a riot up in there, hetero men would be defending their masculinity and the "in the closet" homosexuals/bisexuals would have to respond the same to keep their secret a secret. I guess the big issue is how each individual truly sees a gay or lesbian, some don't mind it, some are detested by it and some enjoy it.
My belief is information there is crucial info that each partner should tell the other before things get too serious so a decision can be made. If you can tolerate that your new love has been with the same sex, then you stay. If you cannot tolerate the news then you leave before things take a real deep turn. I met a guy at Black Lilly in downtown Manhattan, we talked often over the phone, went on a date, he informed me that he used to have a crack addiction (VERY CRUCIAL INFO). At that point before feelings were involved I had the opportunity to make a decision that was best for me. I knew we could converse but there was no future. A few months later I called his place of employment and his boss asked me did I see him and if I did to tell him he was looking for him. I then knew I made the right decision.
Bottom line is keep it honest and give the other person as much info as they need to make a decision that is best for them to achieve their goal. The worse thing to steal from a person is time. This goes for heterosexuals, bisexuals and gays. If you don't see a future with that person let them know. They could pass Mr. and Ms. right every day, all day and they don't see them because they are under the impression they are in a loving relationship when all they are is a hobby, something to do or someone to mooch off of.
--------------------
Your friend's email gives the impression of a New York where the majority of black men are bisexual. Perhaps if these concerns stem from experiences you have already had, we should talk about how some of the characteristics that black women find attractive are prevalent or at least sterotyped to be prevalent in the homo/bisexual community. Although these characteristics (very well dressed, very empathetic to female needs, etc) should in no way enable someone to determine, with 100% certainty, someone else's individual sexual preferences, I would be concerned about dating someone who was so much my best friend, that I didn't need my female friends any longer. Also, there seems to be far more bisexual women than there are bisexual men. Women hate when there is gender based discrimination against them (imagine the baby mama/ baby daddy situation in terms of dating). And cheating is cheating, whether it be with a man or a woman, so if you found someone that you really liked, perhaps it shouldn't matter what kind of relationships they have had in their past as long once you get to the point where you are considering making a commitment you have a good understanding of what the expectations are.
Of course we are married and hopefull won't have to worry about dating ever again!
------------------------------
12.01.2003
Thanksgiving recipe for you
... I'm not even playing...... the recipe is right on their website.... see
for yourself.
http://www.whitecastle.com/_pages/recipe_list.asp?section=recipes&type=DINNER&recipe=9
White Castle Turkey Stuffing
10 White Castle hamburgers, no pickles
1 1/2 cups celery, diced
1 1/4 tsp. ground thyme
1 1/2 tsp. ground sage
3/4 tsp. coarsely ground black pepper
1/4 cup chicken broth
In a large mixing bowl, tear the burgers into pieces and add diced celery
and seasonings. Toss and add chicken broth. Toss well. Stuff cavity of
turkey just before roasting. Makes about 9 cups (enough for a 10- to
12-pound turkey). Note: Allow 1 hamburger for each pound of turkey, which
will be the equivalent of 3/4 cup of stuffing per pound.
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